I've heard today (October 5, 2021) is the official release day of Windows 11. I might see if a Windows 11 update appears in my Windows Update for my PC this evening (I've heard they're not rolling it out all at once). If you're using Windows 11, I'm curious what you think of it?

Nightfox

I've heard today (October 5, 2021) is the official release day of
Windows 11. I might see if a Windows 11 update appears in my Windows Update for my PC this evening (I've heard they're not rolling it out all at once). If you're using Windows 11, I'm curious what you think of it?

Nightfox

I don't use Windows, at all - however I just got a new laptop and think I should have some Windows install...

This new laptop is a powerhouse and... is it smart/the norm to run Windows 11 [or 10] in a VM? I don't really want/need to get OUT of Linux - only have Windows when needed. [Running RipTEL or some light steam games.]

And... does my Windows 10 key work for Windows 11? Hmmmmm....



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: paulie420 to Nightfox on Wed Oct 06 2021 09:24 am

I don't use Windows, at all - however I just got a new laptop and think I should have some Windows install...

This new laptop is a powerhouse and... is it smart/the norm to run Windows 11 [or 10] in a VM? I don't really want/need to get OUT of Linux - only have Windows when needed. [Running RipTEL or some light steam games.]

I don't see anything wrong with running Windows in a VM. There are Mac OS and Linux users who do that.

And... does my Windows 10 key work for Windows 11? Hmmmmm....

Did your new laptop come with Windows? If so, I'd imagine you could make a backup of that and restore the backup in a VM and see if/how well it works. I've heard current users who bought Windows 10 (or had Windows 10 come with a PC/laptop) should be able to update to Windows 11 for free. I don't know if a Windows 10 key will work for a fresh Windows 11 install, but at least a Windows 10 install could be able to update to Windows 11.

Nightfox

Re: Windows 11
By: Nightfox to All on Tue Oct 05 2021 12:47 pm

I've heard today (October 5, 2021) is the official release day of Windows 11. I might see if a Windows 11 update appears in my Windows Update for my PC this evening (I've heard they're not rolling it out all at once). If you're using Windows 11, I'm curious what you think of it?

Microsoft's compatibilty checker says my 16-core AMD Bulldozer server-class processor circa 2015 is not good enough to run Windows 11. I'll see if I can install/upgrade-to it on one of my other Windows systems, but from what I've seen in the preview videos, I'm in no hurry.
--
digital man

Rush quote #75:
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■ Synchronet ■ Vertrauen ■ Home of Synchronet ■ [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net

Hello paulie420!

** On Wednesday 06.10.21 - 09:24, paulie420 wrote to Nightfox:

This new laptop is a powerhouse and... is it smart/the norm to run Windows 11 [or 10] in a VM? I don't really want/need to get OUT of Linux - only have Windows when needed. [Running RipTEL or some light steam games.]

How did you configure your framework laptop?

What's the battery life like?


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* Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
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Re: Windows 11
By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Wed Oct 06 2021 05:25 pm

Microsoft's compatibilty checker says my 16-core AMD Bulldozer server-class processor circa 2015 is not good enough to run Windows 11. I'll see if I can install/upgrade-to it on one of my other Windows systems, but from what I've seen in the preview videos, I'm in no hurry.
--

yeah i'm suprised to see that my i7-7700 processor cant handle it.

that's nuts. whats so special about windows 11.

i'm not going to upgrade; this processor is more than enough for what i do. when i download new games it plays them fine.
---
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Re: Windows 11
By: MRO to Digital Man on Wed Oct 06 2021 09:46 pm

Re: Windows 11
By: Digital Man to Nightfox on Wed Oct 06 2021 05:25 pm

Microsoft's compatibilty checker says my 16-core AMD Bulldozer server-class processor circa 2015 is not good enough to run Windows 11. I'll see if I can install/upgrade-to it on one of my
other Windows systems, but from what I've seen in the preview videos, I'm in no hurry.
--

yeah i'm suprised to see that my i7-7700 processor cant handle it.

that's nuts. whats so special about windows 11.

i'm not going to upgrade; this processor is more than enough for what i do. when i download new games it plays them fine.

You can say that again. Why are regular consumers going to throw perfectly working gear in the trash in order to run a new Windows version is beyond me.

When I was a kid and I used Windows, every time Microsoft released a new version, I feel on my knees tearing my clothes appart and screamin "No, not again! They are forcing an upgrade again!"

Now I use something else, every time my Linux distribution or BSD provider releases something new, I jump up and down yellin "Yay, more awesome stuff for free!"

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

---
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Re: Windows 11
By: Arelor to MRO on Thu Oct 07 2021 05:59 am

yeah i'm suprised to see that my i7-7700 processor cant handle it.

that's nuts. whats so special about windows 11.

i'm not going to upgrade; this processor is more than enough for what i do. when i download new games it plays them fine.

You can say that again. Why are regular consumers going to throw perfectly working gear in the trash in order to run a new Windows version is beyond me.

i think it's because i have something disabled on my motherboard. it would have been nice if it told me WHAT the problem was.

When I was a kid and I used Windows, every time Microsoft released a new version, I feel on my knees tearing my clothes appart and screamin "No, not again! They are forcing an upgrade again!"

you were poor.

Now I use something else, every time my Linux distribution or BSD provider releases something new, I jump up and down yellin "Yay, more awesome stuff for free!"

i'm scared to update my linux OS version. it will probably turn purple and shit.
---
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Re: Windows 11
By: MRO to Digital Man on Wed Oct 06 2021 09:46 pm

yeah i'm suprised to see that my i7-7700 processor cant handle it.

An i7-7700 could probably handle Windows 11 just fine. Microsoft has just chosen not to support that processor.

Nightfox

Re: Windows 11
By: Arelor to MRO on Thu Oct 07 2021 05:59 am

You can say that again. Why are regular consumers going to throw perfectly working gear in the trash in order to run a new Windows version is beyond me.

I heard Windows 10 will still be supported until 2025. So there shouldn't be any problems with that, and by then, many people might want a new PC anyway.

When I was a kid and I used Windows, every time Microsoft released a new version, I feel on my knees tearing my clothes appart and screamin "No, not again! They are forcing an upgrade again!"

I didn't really feel that way when I was a kid.. But maybe it's because when I was a kid, Windows 3.0 and 3.1 were the new things, and when Widnows 95 came out, that was a very significant upgrade. When Windows 95 came out, many people were excited about it, and people even lined up outside of stores to buy it.

My computer wasn't quite powerful enough to run Windows 95 very well at the time, but after a while I bought a new computer.

I thought it was interesting to see the new advancements when new versions of Windows came out. I don't think they're forcing us to upgrade though. We can stick with an older version if we want (though, software companies will eventually stop supporting the older versions).

Nightfox

Re: Windows 11
By: MRO to Arelor on Thu Oct 07 2021 09:03 am

i think it's because i have something disabled on my motherboard. it would have been nice if it told me WHAT the problem was.

I've heard Windows 11 generally only supports 8th-generation and newer Intel Core processors (with some exceptions). So for your i7-7700, it's not just something you can enable on the motherboard. I've read Microsoft apparently says Windows is more stable on newer processors, and they want people to have a good experience with Windows. I also read it may have something to do with the Spectre & Meltdown CPU flaws that were revealed a few years ago, and Microsoft might not want to have to include the software patches for those (the newer processors generally have hardware fixes for those).

Nightfox

Re: Windows 11
By: Nightfox to MRO on Thu Oct 07 2021 09:08 am

Re: Windows 11
By: MRO to Digital Man on Wed Oct 06 2021 09:46 pm

yeah i'm suprised to see that my i7-7700 processor cant handle it.

An i7-7700 could probably handle Windows 11 just fine. Microsoft has just chosen not to support that processor.

Nightfox

i had to turn on 2 features. it couldnt tell that i turned on secure boot.
and my processor is black listed.

for sure it can handle windows 11 just fine.

i'm not sweating it.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Nightfox wrote to All <=-

I've heard today (October 5, 2021) is the official release day of
Windows 11. I might see if a Windows 11 update appears in my Windows Update for my PC this evening (I've heard they're not rolling it out
all at once). If you're using Windows 11, I'm curious what you think
of it?

I don't think I have TPM 2.0 (I have a 3 year-old consumer-grade PC) and the upgrader complains that I have a too-old processor for it (even though it's
a 4-core i7)

Sounds like there's a way to upgrade it, but I'm happy for now - when I upgrade it'll be to elsewhere.


... Overtly resist change
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

paulie420 wrote to Nightfox <=-

I don't use Windows, at all - however I just got a new laptop and think
I should have some Windows install...

This new laptop is a powerhouse and... is it smart/the norm to run
Windows 11 [or 10] in a VM? I don't really want/need to get OUT of
Linux - only have Windows when needed. [Running RipTEL or some light
steam games.]

I've run Windows in Virtualbox for that very reason, but games usually need more than a virtualized GPU. Sounds like you could run QEMU and pass through tasks to the GPU.

And... does my Windows 10 key work for Windows 11? Hmmmmm....

I don't know. It was one of the worst-kept secrets that Windows 7 keys
worked to upgrade to Windows 10, even as of last year.


... Overtly resist change
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

I don't see anything wrong with running Windows in a VM. There are Mac
OS and Linux users who do that.

Yea, so... I spun up a Win10 VM in Proxmox with no issues at all. I mainly use it to use RIPtel for calling RIP boards; but at least I have Windows if NEEDED now. :P

Did your new laptop come with Windows? If so, I'd imagine you could
make a backup of that and restore the backup in a VM and see if/how well it works. I've heard current users who bought Windows 10 (or had
Windows 10 come with a PC/laptop) should be able to update to Windows 11 for free. I don't know if a Windows 10 key will work for a fresh
Windows 11 install, but at least a Windows 10 install could be able to update to Windows 11.

No, I bought it with no OS - but I have a Win10 key that I bought online somewhere... Windows is a funny beast, the copy I have doesn't even ask for a key at all... I think I remember that maybe it asks you after 30 days or whatever. Also, the .iso had "activated" in the filename so... who knows. Either way I have a valid key - maybe I need to hunt down where to enter it in.

And, I installed Windows 10. With 11 right around the corner, I do want to upgrade to it... especially since this install isn't super important or what I use on the daily.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

This new laptop is a powerhouse and... is it smart/the norm to run Og> p> Win
11 [or 10] in a VM? I don't really want/need to get OUT of Linux - Og> p> onl
have Windows when needed. [Running RipTEL or some light steam Og> p> games.]

How did you configure your framework laptop?

What's the battery life like?

I ordered the I7-1165g version, its the middle option with only one better processor available - the I7-1185. I put 32gb of 3200 RAM in it and a 1TB fast SSD. (Wish I'd of bit the bullet and bought a 4TB NVMe - as it only has that one location for drive space.)

Furthermore, I got a bunch of the user ports - one of which is a 256GB USB disk; thats one of my favorite part of the laptop, these user-interchangable user ports. When I first populated them, I put USB-C, mini-SD, HDMI and the 256GB... but have since switched to 2-USB-A, 1-USB-C and the 256GB drive - and moved them around a bit too... its really nice to be able to switch those out on the fly. And, the CAD files are up on github so that we can design anything we might want to cook up. I/O, a magnetic [Magsafe-like] charge port or anything. I anticipate that people might come up with some neat stuff in the future.

I run Fedora on it; I'm normally an Ubuntu guy, but Fedora is supporting the Frame.work and a respin of Fedora 34 has most all the hardware supported - like the fingerprint reader... altho that thing [and all fingerprint readers] kinda suck under Linux anyway. I can't be happier with Fedora, I'm really kinda enjoying it. For me, the GNOME extensions offer enough in customization - I used to like messing around with KDE, but its been nice to just... not. Add some extensions that make sense for me and lean into GNOME - I kinda dig it.

The battery life is decent, but not the best. I'm seeing around 5hrs but I do use the heck out of the machine when I've been testing it. Not too much idling or basic www stuff... I usually have a suite of open software. It has a BIOS option to turn the battery OFF - doesn't sound like you'd need that, but - for me its a good feature. I'm usually on A/C.

The Frame has been pretty nice so far. Now if I had my choice, I'm of wanted an AMD chip. The Intel certainly doesn't have the cores that AMD offers - but I came off 12 year old Thinkpad hardware... to me, this thing screams. I wanted to support Frame.work and what they're trying to do for right to repair. The engineering in this thing is really impressive. Open, scan a QR and info is in front of your face. Nice - they did a good job, too... small things like the keyboard has a fairly long connection cable - you won't rip it out when removing the keyboard.

I'd suggest it to anyone looking for new Intel hardware. Now that the MBPs can take some Linux distros, thats a strong contender IMO - but this is different. I like different. Hopefully the company makes it and offers upgrades in the future. Guess time will tell.

:P



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

My computer is not likely going to handle Windows 11. Ryzen 7 1700, but I am thinking I
might just get a mac mini 16gb ram with 512gb storage and go from there.
---
■ wcQWK 8.0 ≈ Inland Utopia * iutopia.duckdns.org:2323

Re: Windows 11
By: MATTHEW MUNSON to All on Sun Oct 17 2021 07:17 pm

My computer is not likely going to handle Windows 11. Ryzen 7 1700, but I am thinking I
might just get a mac mini 16gb ram with 512gb storage and go from there.

My policy is not to upgrade my hardware just because some shinny software appeared over the horizon. Specially if I don't need the new software. Most often I can't justify the expense.

I mean I am running on junk hardware from 2007 and I am more productive than a lot of people running the newest cool thing on the newest cool hardware.


--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

---
■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL

Re: Windows 11
By: Arelor to MATTHEW MUNSON on Wed Oct 20 2021 07:13 am

My policy is not to upgrade my hardware just because some shinny software appeared over the horizon. Specially if I don't need the new software. Most often I can't justify the expense.

I heard Windows 10 will still be supported until 2025. So there's still some time.

Nightfox

Re: Windows 11
By: Nightfox to Arelor on Wed Oct 20 2021 10:03 am

Re: Windows 11
By: Arelor to MATTHEW MUNSON on Wed Oct 20 2021 07:13 am

My policy is not to upgrade my hardware just because some shinny software appeared over the
horizon. Specially if I don't need the new software. Most often I can't justify the expense

I heard Windows 10 will still be supported until 2025. So there's still some time.

Nightfox

I couldn't care less. OpenBSD 7.0 got released recently and that is what I am upgrading stuff too.
Yay!

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

---
■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL

Re: Windows 11
By: MATTHEW MUNSON to All on Sun Oct 17 2021 07:17 pm

My computer is not likely going to handle Windows 11. Ryzen 7 1700, but I am might just get a mac mini 16gb ram with 512gb storage and go from there.

No better time to ditch Windows than during a new version release. You'll never miss it unless you're a pc gamer

---
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Re: Windows 11
By: Moondog to MATTHEW MUNSON on Wed Oct 20 2021 07:27 pm

Re: Windows 11
By: MATTHEW MUNSON to All on Sun Oct 17 2021 07:17 pm

My computer is not likely going to handle Windows 11. Ryzen 7 1700, but I am might just get a mac mini 16gb ram with 512gb storage and go from there.

No better time to ditch Windows than during a new version release. You'll never miss it unless you're a pc gamer

well we have 25 years. pretty sure windows 11 wont be around by then. for whatever their reasons for blacklisting some processors, there's a chance they will create a work around.

i prefer windows 10 but i always have a linux console open.
---
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Arelor wrote to MATTHEW MUNSON <=-

@MSGID: <617007F2.1681.dove-hwswhelp@palantirbbs.ddns.net>
@REPLY: <616F9DDD.17449.dove-hlp@vert.synchro.net>
Re: Windows 11
By: MATTHEW MUNSON to All on
Sun Oct 17 2021 07:17 pm

My computer is not likely going to handle Windows 11. Ryzen 7 1700, but I am thinking I
might just get a mac mini 16gb ram with 512gb storage and go from there.

My policy is not to upgrade my hardware just because some shinny
software appeared over the horizon. Specially if I don't need the new software. Most often I can't justify the expense.

I mean I am running on junk hardware from 2007 and I am more productive than a lot of people running the newest cool thing on the newest cool hardware.

My desktop machine, which is the most powerful I have, is from 2009. And yes, I am more productive than most others. New computers are overrated. It is your software choice and how you use it more than the hardware which matters.

... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org

Re: Windows 11
By: MRO to Moondog on Thu Oct 21 2021 04:17 am

No better time to ditch Windows than during a new version release.
You'll never miss it unless you're a pc gamer

well we have 25 years. pretty sure windows 11 wont be around by then. for

25 years? What's happening in 2046?

Nightfox

Re: Windows 11
By: Nightfox to MRO on Thu Oct 21 2021 09:37 am

well we have 25 years. pretty sure windows 11 wont be around by then. for

25 years? What's happening in 2046?

eol
---
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Re: Windows 11
By: MRO to Moondog on Thu Oct 21 2021 04:17 am

No better time to ditch Windows than during a new version release.
You'll never miss it unless you're a pc gamer

well we have 25 years. pretty sure windows 11 wont be around by then. for whatever their reasons for blacklisting some processors, there's a chance they will create a work around.

I've been running Windows 11 for quite awhile now, as I'm on the "Fast Track" for Windows Insider. Technicaly the CPU I use is not supported (Intel I7-6700K), but I guess they removed the "blacklisting" stuff for the Insider builds.

It's been running fine. I barely notice any difference, other than right-click menus being drastically simplified (grr). I was able to move the taskbar back to a more standard windows layout, with the start button on the left.

The fucking start menu though. ooh boy. I hate it. I hate it more than I hated the fuckup that was Windows 8.

If I'm forced to roll back at some point, I probably will, and I'll stick with windows 10. I did upgrade my RAM to 64GB a few weeks ago, and popped in a new video card (since I was able to get one at a halfway decent price).

If I have to upgrade the CPU/Motherboard, I'll probably go AMD. Which means I'll have to buy new RAM, too, but the old stuff is easy enough to sell on ebay for a decent price.

The 512GB m.2 drive, and my two 1TB m.2 drives can just just stay where they are.

i prefer windows 10 but i always have a linux console open.

DaiTengu

... Failure is a measurement that depends on the standard applied.

---
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Re: Windows 11
By: DaiTengu to MRO on Thu Oct 21 2021 07:19 pm

It's been running fine. I barely notice any difference, other than right-click menus being drastically simplified (grr). I was able to move

One of the items on this page explains how to get the full context menus back in Windows 11:
https://cnet.co/3DVyuv0

Full URL: https://www.cnet.com/tech/services-and-software/youve-just-installed-windows-11 -heres-how-to-make-it-more-like-windows-10/

Nightfox

Re: Windows 11
By: DaiTengu to MRO on Thu Oct 21 2021 07:19 pm

The fucking start menu though. ooh boy. I hate it. I hate it more than I hated the fuckup that was Windows 8.

see if you can use that start menu replacement. i cant remember the name but it's on nnite.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Arelor wrote to Nightfox <=-

I couldn't care less. OpenBSD 7.0 got released recently and that is
what I am upgrading stuff too. Yay!

Dang, I knew I forgot something when I was in the office yesterday!

We have 2 300/300 circuits in an empty office, when I go into the office I make a point of saturating it. I've been uploading all of my media to
OneDrive and downloading ISOs.


... Try faking it
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

On 10/5/21 12:47 PM, Nightfox wrote:

I've heard today (October 5, 2021) is the official release day of
Windows 11. I might see if a Windows 11 update appears in my Windows
Update for my PC this evening (I've heard they're not rolling it out
all at once). If you're using Windows 11, I'm curious what you think
of it?

Been running insiders for a few years... Win11 is ok-ish... but the
second time it blew up on me... I'm back onLinux, if that says anything.
--
Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com
---
￭ Synchronet ￭ Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com

On 10/7/21 9:08 AM, Nightfox wrote:

yeah i'm suprised to see that my i7-7700 processor cant handle it.

An i7-7700 could probably handle Windows 11 just fine. Microsoft
has just chosen not to support that processor.

They're drawing a line in the sand at TPM2 and Secure Boot.
--
Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com
---
￭ Synchronet ￭ Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: Tracker1 to Nightfox on Fri Oct 22 2021 11:29 pm

On 10/7/21 9:08 AM, Nightfox wrote:

yeah i'm suprised to see that my i7-7700 processor cant handle it.

An i7-7700 could probably handle Windows 11 just fine. Microsoft
has just chosen not to support that processor.

They're drawing a line in the sand at TPM2 and Secure Boot.
--
Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com

i have those 2 things. and they're switched on. my processor is still blacklisted.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: Tracker1 to Nightfox on Fri Oct 22 2021 11:29 pm

An i7-7700 could probably handle Windows 11 just fine. Microsoft
has just chosen not to support that processor.

They're drawing a line in the sand at TPM2 and Secure Boot.

I don't think those depend on the processor though..

Nightfox

Re: Windows 11
By: Nightfox to DaiTengu on Thu Oct 21 2021 08:15 pm

It's been running fine. I barely notice any difference, other than
right-click menus being drastically simplified (grr). I was able to
move

One of the items on this page explains how to get the full context menus back in Windows 11: https://cnet.co/3DVyuv0

Full URL: https://www.cnet.com/tech/services-and-software/youve-just-installed-windo ws-11 -heres-how-to-make-it-more-like-windows-10/

Apparently I had an old, but still valid Stardock license. Start11 (which is still in beta) replaces the start menu with a Win10, Win7, or even a "Modern" style which is more like WinXP's layout but with a look that matches your desktop.

I went back to the Win10 layout because I oddly miss my tiles in my start menu. But now I need to try and rearrange them all in groups like I had them.


For the record, Stardock's licensing is trash. and I'm only using this because i foolishly gave them money a long time ago. I'll use it until I can't, then I'll figure something else out.

I'd love to switch over to pure Linux, but I have too many programs and games that rely on Windows. Hell my Windows 11 install has multiple Linux distros installed via W4L already that I use, and I have a half dozen other machines in myself that run Linux or *BSD.

DaiTengu

... I reserve my abuse for lower life forms, like Civil Servants.

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

Re: Windows 11
By: DaiTengu to Nightfox on Sun Oct 24 2021 10:35 am

matches your desktop.

I went back to the Win10 layout because I oddly miss my tiles in my start menu. But now I need to try and rearrange them all in groups like I had them.

For the record, Stardock's licensing is trash. and I'm only using this because i foolishly gave them money a long time ago. I'll use it until I can't, then I'll figure something else out.

does classic start work out fine for you? it's on nnite.
what i remember about windowblinds is it takes up a lot of resources and craps out a lot.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Windows 11
By: DaiTengu to Nightfox on Sun Oct 24 2021 10:35 am

Apparently I had an old, but still valid Stardock license. Start11 (which is still in beta) replaces the start menu with a Win10, Win7, or even a "Modern" style which is more like WinXP's layout but with a look that matches your desktop.

I have a Stardock Object Desktop license. I've used their Start10, but I've been using Classic Shell, which is free (though I think they take donations). I'm not sure if Classic Shell has been updated to support Windows 11 properly.. I'm using it in Windows 11, but I have both the Classic Shell button and the Windows 11 Start Menu button. I should check to see if Classic Shell has been updated.

For the record, Stardock's licensing is trash. and I'm only using this because i foolishly gave them money a long time ago. I'll use it until I can't, then I'll figure something else out.

Weird.. I haven't had that issue. Stardock does a yearly license though, and one thing I don't like is paying a recurring license fee. But you can continue to use it after your license expires, but without getting any updates.

I'd love to switch over to pure Linux, but I have too many programs and games that rely on Windows. Hell my Windows 11 install has multiple Linux distros installed via W4L already that I use, and I have a half dozen other machines in myself that run Linux or *BSD.

What do you mean by "pure Linux"?

Nightfox

No better time to ditch Windows than during a new version release.
You'll
never miss it unless you're a pc gamer

My main gaming is on the PS5 and Switch. I play some retro games on the
ios like the pixel remasters of final fantasy and the dragon quest series.


---
■ Talisman ■ Inland Utopia - telnet://iutopia.duckdns.org:2023

They're drawing a line in the sand at TPM2 and Secure Boot.

Even if I am TPM2 and reinstalled in secure boot, they will not let me
run Win 11 on my Ryzen.


---
■ Talisman ■ Inland Utopia - telnet://iutopia.duckdns.org:2023

I'd love to switch over to pure Linux, but I have too many programs and games that rely on Windows. Hell my Windows 11 install has multiple Linux distros installed via W4L already that I use, and I have a half dozen other machines in

I'm currently giving ZorinOS Pro an install. It, unlike ZorinOS Core, has Win/MacOS and other themes included and also has WINE *setup* for a user that might not grasp how to do that in a usable way. WINE allows you to run some, if not most, Windows applications under Linux.

It might be a good OS for you to give a try... it costs $39, but like I stated above you can try Core out for free - I think that Core still has WINE installed... just no support from the Zorin folks.

I don't have any track record with this distro, I'm just now installing... but its description sure fits what you stated you wished for.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

paulie420 wrote to DaiTengu <=-

It might be a good OS for you to give a try... it costs $39, but like I stated above you can try Core out for free - I think that Core still
has WINE installed... just no support from the Zorin folks.

I was meaning to swap out my boot drive and run Zorin for a while; have it running in a VM and like it.

My wife and I were going to make a big purchase on one of our cards, and she wasn't sure it worked - she thought maybe she hadn't called to register it.
I suggested she make a small online purchase on it, and she didn't have time to do it.

I somehow found myself looking up 1TB SSDs on Amazon. Just to make sure the card works... :)


... Trust in the you of now
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

I somehow found myself looking up 1TB SSDs on Amazon. Just to make sure the card works... :)

Riiiiiiiiight. :P

I'm happily digging into Zorin Pro. I like it.
It's heavy but pretty.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
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Re: Windows 11
By: MRO to DaiTengu on Sun Oct 24 2021 01:33 pm

For the record, Stardock's licensing is trash. and I'm only using this
because i foolishly gave them money a long time ago. I'll use it
until I can't, then I'll figure something else out.

does classic start work out fine for you? it's on nnite.
what i remember about windowblinds is it takes up a lot of resources and craps out a lot. ---

I haven't given it a shot. Start11 is doing it for me right now (Which is the Stardock App) It's not eating too much in the way of resources, but I've got plenty of RAM to feed it right now (64GB).

I tried to find "Classic Start" as a standalone (Not part of NiNite), and can only come up with "Classic Shell". the Classic Shell website appears to be unresponsive for me right now.

DaiTengu

... Either one of us, by himself, is expendable. Both of us are not.

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

Re: Windows 11
By: Nightfox to DaiTengu on Sun Oct 24 2021 07:28 pm

I'd love to switch over to pure Linux, but I have too many programs
and games that rely on Windows. Hell my Windows 11 install has
multiple Linux distros installed via W4L already that I use, and I
have a half dozen other machines in myself that run Linux or *BSD.

What do you mean by "pure Linux"?

I have 6 computers here at home. 2 run Windows, 5 run various flavors of Linux, and one runs FreeBSD (pfSense), but I don't really count that as a PC I use, since it's really just functions as a router.

That doesn't include the 4 Raspberry Pis, that all run some derivative of Debian/Ubuntu, either. Nor my wife's desktop and laptop (which both run Windows)

If I moved my two Windows PCs to Linux, I'd consider that "pure linux". Really it's just a phrase I picked up from talking to various other Sysadmin/DevOps/SREs, who say they work in a "pure linux shop"

DaiTengu

... The name of the popular lubricant WD-40 stands for "Water Displacement, 40th formula".

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: paulie420 to DaiTengu on Mon Oct 25 2021 03:46 pm

I'm currently giving ZorinOS Pro an install. It, unlike ZorinOS Core, has Win/MacOS and other themes included and also has WINE *setup* for a user that might not grasp how to do that in a usable way. WINE allows you to run some, if not most, Windows applications under Linux.

It might be a good OS for you to give a try... it costs $39, but like I stated above you can try Core out for free - I think that Core still has WINE installed... just no support from the Zorin folks.

I'm pretty familiar with WINE. The ham radio applications I use on Windows don't have an equivelant counterpart under Linux, and are too complex for WINE to deal with, with serial connections audio cabling and whatnot.

Also, newer video games never run well under WINE, if at all. I just picked up the new Guardians of the Galaxy game, as of right now reports are it won't run at all under WINE (or any of the forks designed for PC Gaming).


The other reason I stick with Windows is because it's mindless. I can install and run whatever without having to tinker and fiddle with things, or edit 30 different config files, or find the right library for compatability.

I spent all day dealing with Linux at work. when I'm done with work, I don't want to spend my free time dealing with it, too.

DaiTengu

... Tolkien is hobbit-forming.

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

Re: Windows 11
By: DaiTengu to Nightfox on Fri Oct 29 2021 10:07 am

I'd love to switch over to pure Linux, but I have too many programs

What do you mean by "pure Linux"?

I have 6 computers here at home. 2 run Windows, 5 run various flavors of Linux, and one runs FreeBSD (pfSense), but I don't really count that as a PC I use, since it's really just functions as a router.

If I moved my two Windows PCs to Linux, I'd consider that "pure linux". Really it's just a phrase I picked up from talking to various other Sysadmin/DevOps/SREs, who say they work in a "pure linux shop"

Ah, I see. All Linux computers.. I was wondering if you meant Linux itself without any GNU tools etc.. :P

Nightfox

Also, newer video games never run well under WINE, if at all. I just picked up the new Guardians of the Galaxy game, as of right now reports are it won't run at all under WINE (or any of the forks designed for PC Gaming).

In addition, not many of the off-the-beaten-path apps I want to use play nice with WINE, either; like ACID View or RIPtel... and they are pretty flipping simple.

ZorinOS *attempts* to make things easier, but probably works better with consumer based apps and games a lot better than the weird stuff I want to run...

The other reason I stick with Windows is because it's mindless. I can install and run whatever without having to tinker and fiddle with
things, or edit 30 different config files, or find the right library for compatability.

You know, I'm currently working with this frame.work laptop on Linux... and while I don't think I'd be happy w/ Windows - I *know* that everything would just work if I went that route...

What you say about working with nix at work kinda... resonates with me. All my other machines are nix, and just an ssh window away; JESUS, should I break down and install Windows?!?!?!?

NO!!! :P If it were MacOS, I would... but I can't goto Win.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
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Re: Windows 11
By: DaiTengu to MRO on Fri Oct 29 2021 09:58 am

I tried to find "Classic Start" as a standalone (Not part of NiNite), and can only come up with "Classic Shell". the Classic Shell website appears to be unresponsive for me right now.

DaiTengu

just use this https://ninite.com/classicstart/

their website is http://www.classicshell.net/
which works for me right now.

he stopped development but it still works.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

DaiTengu wrote to paulie420 <=-

@MSGID: <617C0FFD.2972.dove-hwswhelp@warensemble.com>
@REPLY: <61773578.17473.dove-hlp@vert.synchro.net>
Re: Re: Windows 11
By: paulie420 to DaiTengu on
Mon Oct 25 2021 03:46 pm

I'm currently giving ZorinOS Pro an install. It, unlike ZorinOS Core, has Win/MacOS and other themes included and also has WINE *setup* for a user that might not grasp how to do that in a usable way. WINE allows you to run some, if not most, Windows applications under Linux.

It might be a good OS for you to give a try... it costs $39, but like I stated above you can try Core out for free - I think that Core still has WINE installed... just no support from the Zorin folks.

I'm pretty familiar with WINE. The ham radio applications I use on Windows don't have an equivelant counterpart under Linux, and are too complex for WINE to deal with, with serial connections audio cabling
and whatnot.

Also, newer video games never run well under WINE, if at all. I just picked up the new Guardians of the Galaxy game, as of right now reports are it won't run at all under WINE (or any of the forks designed for PC Gaming).

The other reason I stick with Windows is because it's mindless. I can install and run whatever without having to tinker and fiddle with
things, or edit 30 different config files, or find the right library
for compatability.

I spent all day dealing with Linux at work. when I'm done with work, I don't want to spend my free time dealing with it, too.

Wierd, I moved away from Windows to Linux because I didn't want to mess around with the OS all the time. Granted this was back in 2000, and I was using Windows 98, but I got tired of reinstalling Windows 98 all the time, having to wipe it, reinstal, put my configuration back the way I liked it. With Linux I wanted an OS I could install once, configure, and it would stay that way.

... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org

Moondog wrote to MATTHEW MUNSON <=-

No better time to ditch Windows than during a new version release.
You'll never miss it unless you're a pc gamer

My old laptop can not handle new releases of Windows 10 :( So I installed ibuntu on it, now it loads faster. 2nd gen i5 laptop with 8gb ram. Maybe I
could find a 7200 rpm laptop hard drive, but the laptop is almost 10 years ld.

Desktop computers that can game are becoming too pricey. I cant justify burning 1500 bucks on one now.


... Don't compromise your freedoms for protection.

---
■ Talisman ■ Inland Utopia - telnet://iutopia.duckdns.org:2023

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: Utopian Galt to Moondog on Sat Nov 06 2021 09:37 pm

Moondog wrote to MATTHEW MUNSON <=-

No better time to ditch Windows than during a new version release. You'll never miss it unless you're a pc gamer

My old laptop can not handle new releases of Windows 10 :( So I installed ibuntu on it, now it loads faster. 2nd gen i5 laptop with 8gb ram. Maybe I could find a 7200 rpm laptop hard drive, but the laptop is almost 10 years l

Desktop computers that can game are becoming too pricey. I cant justify burning 1500 bucks on one now.

... Don't compromise your freedoms for protection.

Fun fact: a friend of mine has an old computer he intended to use for gaming, but since it can no longer cope with new games, he decided to install Linux on it and a bunch of retro emulators. He is having a blast playing old games from the 90s and beyond.

I think paying more than 1000 bucks for a computer you don't intend to use for production is hard to justify.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

---
■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL

Utopian Galt wrote to Moondog <=-

Desktop computers that can game are becoming too pricey. I cant justify burning 1500 bucks on one now.

I bought a used Dell Inspiron 3847 with an i7 and 16 GB of RAM for $175.
Added a $100 Nvidia card, think it's a GT1030, and I can get 60 FPS out of
War Thunder at medium res. 40 at high. 50 when I custom tune it based on the Nvidia optimizing app.


... Simple subtraction
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Utopian Galt on Mon Nov 08 2021 08:28 am

Utopian Galt wrote to Moondog <=-

Desktop computers that can game are becoming too pricey. I cant justify burning 1500 bucks on one now.

I bought a used Dell Inspiron 3847 with an i7 and 16 GB of RAM for $175. Added a $100 Nvidia card, think it's a GT1030, and I can get 60 FPS out of War Thunder at medium res. 40 at high. 50 when I custom tune it based on the Nvidia optimizing app.

... Simple subtraction

I probably shoulñd not be asking this, but did you buy it from a shady guy in a dark alley in Detroit or something? Because dealers of used IT have computers like that in store but they don't sell them for 175 bucks precisely.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

---
￭ Synchronet ￭ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: Arelor to poindexter FORTRAN on Wed Nov 10 2021 05:06 pm

I probably shoul¡d not be asking this, but did you buy it from a shady guy in
a dark alley in Detroit or something? Because dealers of used IT have computers like that in store but they don't sell them for 175 bucks precisely.

in the usa we can usually get stuff like this from ebay but the memory isnt normally that high. maybe 4-8gigs.
poindexter probably doesnt know how much memory he has and got the video card model wrong.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

On 10/24/21 10:56, Matthew Munson wrote:

They're drawing a line in the sand at TPM2 and Secure Boot.

Even if I am TPM2 and reinstalled in secure boot, they will
not let me run Win 11 on my Ryzen.

Zen 1 had support for a virtual TPM2? I think there's similar issues
for those with Core 6000 series as well, or maybe 8000 series.
--
Michael J. Ryan - tracker1@roughneckbbs.com
---
￭ Synchronet ￭ Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com

just use this https://ninite.com/classicstart/

I would suggest getting chocolatey set up and doing:

choco install classic-shell

The advantage is that choco is actually something close to a package manager. It'll track dependencies, and handle upgrades.

I would find Windows even more insufferable if I couldn't just do:

choco upgrade all

To get pretty much everything up to date effortlessly.

It's also good enough I have used it in cloud setup scripts to create AMIs for servers. (I'm an AWS drone)

... I think you had better see who's at home - Picard

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: Roc to MRO on Thu Nov 11 2021 10:27 pm

just use this https://ninite.com/classicstart/

I would suggest getting chocolatey set up and doing:

choco install classic-shell

The advantage is that choco is actually something close to a package manager. It'll track dependencies, and handle upgrades.

yeah i use that too. but i dont install a lot of programs.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Arelor wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

I probably shoul-d not be asking this, but did you buy it from a shady
guy in a dark alley in Detroit or something? Because dealers of used IT have computers like that in store but they don't sell them for 175
bucks precisely.

We have a Thrift store called Grey Bears in Santa Cruz, CA. It's a huge operation run for seniors. They do building material recycling, e-waste,
food programs for seniors, and have a thriving thrift shop.

Their computer and electronics section is pretty impressive; I've recently bought a nice, new to me stereo receiver there for $60 and a Synology
DS1010+ chassis for $130.


... Apotheosis was the beginning before the beginning.
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.

operation run for seniors. They do building material recycling,
e-waste,

I think that is a good idea, help to make older technology usable. Make a
10 year old laptop serviable for another 5 years, or use parts from older desktops to make a semi updated computer.


---
■ Talisman ■ Inland Utopia - telnet://iutopia.duckdns.org:2023

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: Utopian Galt to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Nov 12 2021 09:06 pm

operation run for seniors. They do building material recycling,
e-waste,

I think that is a good idea, help to make older technology usable. Make a
10 year old laptop serviable for another 5 years, or use parts from older desktops to make a semi updated computer.

as an electronics tech who worked in RMA departments, i'd have to say putting old parts to make a computer to give to another is a receipe for disaster.

that computer will just blow out something and then it will have to be serviced again. that would be more expensive overall than getting them a cheap computer with new parts.

using old stuff just doesnt pan out.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

using old stuff just doesnt pan out.

My own experience is that reusing is fine, if and only if:
- Decent case (positive air flow, filters, not an oven).
- Good PSU (By the popular "psu tier list", tier 2 at worst).

I have found these two points make the difference between "hardware breaks, eventually" and "hardware doesn't break, ever".

My family (extended) is all using old parts, and so far (~10 year) no issues.

... The power came on. - Kirk

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: MRO to Utopian Galt on Sat Nov 13 2021 08:38 am

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: Utopian Galt to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Nov 12 2021 09:06 pm

operation run for seniors. They do building material recycling, e-waste,

I think that is a good idea, help to make older technology usable. Make a 10 year old laptop serviable for another 5 years, or use parts from older desktops to make a semi updated computer.

as an electronics tech who worked in RMA departments, i'd have to say puttin

that computer will just blow out something and then it will have to be servi

using old stuff just doesnt pan out.

The e-recycling places in my area that try to recover money through store
front used computer and part salesdo not offer up much stuff past 5 years
old. If it was worth anything it would sell quickly or in the case of older stuff it would stripped down to recover materials. One place the company I worked for would donate machines to stopped taking CRT's then eventually hardware over 7 years old because they couldn't flip it.

---
■ Synchronet ■ The Cave BBS - Since 1992 - cavebbs.homeip.net

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: Roc to MRO on Sun Nov 14 2021 01:06 pm

using old stuff just doesnt pan out.

My own experience is that reusing is fine, if and only if:
- Decent case (positive air flow, filters, not an oven).
- Good PSU (By the popular "psu tier list", tier 2 at worst).

I have found these two points make the difference between "hardware breaks, eventually" and "hardware doesn't break, ever".

My family (extended) is all using old parts, and so far (~10 year) no issues.

i'm talking about giving stuff to people. go ahead and put old stuff together for yourself.
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

On 10/20/2021 7:13 AM, ARELOR wrote to MATTHEW MUNSON:

My policy is not to upgrade my hardware just because some shinny software appeared over the horizon. Specially if I don't need the new software. Most often I can't justify the expense.

I mean I am running on junk hardware from 2007 and I am more productive than a
lot of people running the newest cool thing on the newest cool hardware.

I am thinking just getting a 1tb SSD stick for my desktop and just enjoy my ryzen box for
another 3-4 years. PC Gaming is becoming way too expensive.

---
■ wcQWK 8.0 ≈ Inland Utopia * iutopia.duckdns.org:2323

Re: RE: Windows 11
By: MATTHEW MUNSON to ARELOR on Fri Nov 05 2021 07:42 pm

On 10/20/2021 7:13 AM, ARELOR wrote to MATTHEW MUNSON:

My policy is not to upgrade my hardware just because some shinny software appear
over the horizon. Specially if I don't need the new software. Most often I can't
justify the expense.

I mean I am running on junk hardware from 2007 and I am more productive than a
lot of people running the newest cool thing on the newest cool hardware.

I am thinking just getting a 1tb SSD stick for my desktop and just enjoy my ryzen b
for
another 3-4 years. PC Gaming is becoming way too expensive.

You could do worse than that.

You can play a lot of cool old games with junkyard computers. Experience the full
power of DOS games! Hell you can even play the original Diablo using FOSS engines on
pretty low end hardware.

--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

---
■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: DaiTengu to paulie420 on Fri Oct 29 2021 10:15:09

I'm pretty familiar with WINE. The ham radio applications I use on Windows don't have an equivelant counterpart under Linux, and are too complex for WINE to deal with, with serial connections audio cabling and whatnot.

What ham apps are you running in Windows?

---
■ Synchronet ■ Zruspa's BBS

On 12/1/2021 1:32 PM, ARELOR wrote to MATTHEW MUNSON:

You could do worse than that.

You can play a lot of cool old games with junkyard computers. Experience the full
power of DOS games! Hell you can even play the original Diablo using FOSS engines on
pretty low end hardware.

Yeah, I think I am getting burned out of gaming. There is a huge backlog of unplayed
games I have. Its a first world collectors burden.
---
■ wcQWK 8.0 ≈ Inland Utopia * iutopia.duckdns.org:2323

Re: RE: Windows 11
By: MATTHEW MUNSON to ARELOR on Mon Dec 20 2021 10:19 pm

pretty low end hardware.

Yeah, I think I am getting burned out of gaming. There is a huge backlog of unplayed
games I have. Its a first world collectors burden.

must be nice. i work so much i don't have time for playing games.

do you have a full time job?
---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: Joe Phigan to DaiTengu on Sat Dec 11 2021 12:15 pm

I'm pretty familiar with WINE. The ham radio applications I use on
Windows don't have an equivelant counterpart under Linux, and are too
complex for WINE to deal with, with serial connections audio cabling
and whatnot.

What ham apps are you running in Windows?

Win4Icom, ACLog (N3FJP's logging software), Winlink + VARA, Ham Radio Deluxe (mostly for the digital mode stuff), various stuff for digital modes (YSF, Wires-X DMR and D-Star) Occasionally I use CW Skimmer.

Those are the ones that are strictly limited to Windows. other stuff I run is WSJT-X and/or JTDX, fldigi from time to time, and GridTracker. These all have native linux binaries.

DaiTengu

... Pohl's law: Nothing is so good that somebody, somewhere, will not hate it

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

Re: RE: Windows 11
By: MATTHEW MUNSON to ARELOR on Mon Dec 20 2021 10:19 pm

Yeah, I think I am getting burned out of gaming. There is a huge backlog of unplayed games I have. Its a first world collectors burden.

Yeah, tell me about it.

https://steamdb.info/calculator/76561197960380065/?cc=us

DaiTengu

... Diogenes is still searching.

---
■ Synchronet ■ War Ensemble BBS - The sport is war, total war - warensemble.com

must be nice. i work so much i don't have time for playing games.

do you have a full time job?

Yes, I have been employed except for some down time between jobs.

... Confucius say: "Man who runs behind car gets exhausted"

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/25 (Windows/32)
* Origin: Inland Utopia BBS

Re: Re: Windows 11
By: MATT MUNSON to MRO on Wed Dec 29 2021 02:35 pm

must be nice. i work so much i don't have time for playing games.

do you have a full time job?

Yes, I have been employed except for some down time between jobs.

i dont know how you have time to do that gaming.
arent you old like me?

---
■ Synchronet ■ ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::