Sometimes I think it would be fun to buy a '90s Power Mac (probably a 8500) or an Amiga to have actual hardware to play with. I never really used Macs at home, but my schools always had Macs, and sometimes I feel a bit nostalgic. Also, I've never used Amiga either, and never really had much exposure to them, but I've thought it would be fun to have an Amiga to play with since I never really got a chance to back in the 90s. It seems used Amigas are quite a bit more expensive than '90s PowerMacs though..

Also, from what I've heard, it sounds like one concern with older computers is the possible need for them to be recapped. I'm okay with soldering and could probably do that myself, though I might find someone who could do it better and pay them to do it if needed.. Also, I've seen a lot of sellers (on Facebook Marketplace, mainly) who say they're selling for local pickup only and don't want to ship because they're concerned about damage in shipping. It's a bummer, because I almost never see a retro computer for sale in my area on Facebook Marketplace.

Nightfox

Also, from what I've heard, it sounds like one concern with older computers is the possible need for them to be recapped. I'm okay with

I purchased MIST FPGA back in 2015 or so and instantly installed Amiga Cores on it. It came with superb experience for gaming software as it accepted DB9 joysticks and also had MIDI ports. Later improvements introduced Akiko chip (hardware supported chunky to planar, which is required for Amiga CD32 emulation) and Picasso compatible RTG card. I purchased bunch of different Quick Shot joysticks for under 20 bucks each and I still have fun with this whole setup. I'm still planning to solder up rpi-zero to the fpga port to bring wifi connection to this whole setup. That would be my ideal mid-range Amiga, effectively hardware-emulating 040 + RTG and perfect for retro gaming.

I say hardware emulating as this is fpga so the core is hardware circuit emulator, not software emulation. Much more accurate and feels like real thing.

Why I started explaining FPGA while you seek real hardware?
Because in 2016 I purchased real Amiga 1200 that yes, indeed requires recapping, CIA port responsible for mouse control got damaged a year later and today have semi-working computer that comes with bad video signal and no right click and I'm no soldering pal. I keep postponing to send that hardware to some expert in my hood to fix it as the FPGA computer just works fine!.

Most likely I'll sell this Amiga when I fix it as the FPGA experience is so much real (and joysticks make it real, as you don't want to play Amiga games on PC's gamepads or keyboard).

For the same reason, The C64 Maxi is better than real computer as it's stable, shows visuals in HD, accepts USB joysticks and comes with real C64 keyboard which you need to feel the thing.

If you want Amiga experience, sure buy the computer, but the prices became so ridiculous that vanilla A1200 today costs more than that G5 Mac on which you can install Amiga OS 4.0/MorphOS to get PPC Amiga feeling, which is bizarre, yet alien to many who never could afford it back in the times.

If your Amiga deal is more than 500 bucks then I recommend, buy V4-Stand Alone from Apollo COmputers.

-h1

... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A48 (Linux/64)
* Origin: 2o fOr beeRS bbS>>20ForBeers.com:1337 (21:2/150)

You might be able to pick up a PowerMac for relatively cheap. An Amiga,
though, probably not so much. The retrocomputer market went completely
bonkers during the pandemic, and only recently seems to be calming down a little bit. Commodore stuff, particuarly anything related to Amiga, is
.

---
* Origin: Telnet: bbs.WalledCTTY.com:1989 - Fort Collins, CO USA (21:2/145)

Re: Re: Buying a retro '90s Mac or Amiga
By: hollowone to Nightfox on Sun Dec 31 2023 12:54 am

I purchased MIST FPGA back in 2015 or so and instantly installed Amiga Cores on it. It came with superb experience for gaming software as it accepted DB9 joysticks and also had MIDI ports. Later improvements introduced Akiko chip (hardware supported chunky to planar, which is required for Amiga CD32 emulation) and Picasso compatible RTG card. I purchased bunch of different Quick Shot joysticks for under 20 bucks each and I still have fun with this whole setup. I'm still planning to solder up rpi-zero to the fpga port to bring wifi connection to this whole setup. That would be my ideal mid-range Amiga, effectively hardware-emulating 040 + RTG and perfect for retro gaming.

Interesting.. I wasn't aware of this MIST FPGA computer. It looks like something I might consider.

so ridiculous that vanilla A1200 today costs more than that G5 Mac on which you can install Amiga OS 4.0/MorphOS to get PPC Amiga feeling, which is bizarre, yet alien to many who never could afford it back in the times.

I had a thought about buying a Mac Mini G4, which I've heard can run Mac OS 9.2.2 (even though not officially supported), and the Mac Mini takes up a lot less space than a G3 desktop/tower beige Mac that I had been considering. I wonder if a Mac Mini G4 could also run Amiga OS..

If your Amiga deal is more than 500 bucks then I recommend, buy V4-Stand Alone from Apollo COmputers.

I'll have to check them out. Thanks.

Nightfox

Re: Buying a retro '90s Mac or Amiga
By: Abbub to Nightfox on Sun Dec 31 2023 09:42 am

You might be able to pick up a PowerMac for relatively cheap. An Amiga, though, probably not so much. The retrocomputer market went completely bonkers during the pandemic, and only recently seems to be calming down a little bit. Commodore stuff, particuarly anything related to Amiga, is .

Yeah, it's weird. I'm wondering why Amiga prices are so high, and I wonder if it's because Amiga was (I think) less popular and could be more sought-after these days.

Nightfox

Sometimes I think it would be fun to buy a '90s Power Mac (probably a 8500) or an Amiga to have actual hardware to play with. I never really used Macs at home, but my schools always had Macs, and sometimes I feel
a bit nostalgic. Also, I've never used Amiga either, and never really
had much exposure to them, but I've thought it would be fun to have an Amiga to play with since I never really got a chance to back in the 90s. It seems used Amigas are quite a bit more expensive than '90s PowerMacs though..

A suggestion if you're into Mac OS9 would be to buy a G4 Mac Mini. There are community efforts which have made it possible to run OS9 natively on the Mac Mini. Running OS9 at 1.5ghz on a G4 is pretty slick :)

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: m O N T E R E Y b B S . c O M (21:4/173)

Re: Re: Buying a retro '90s Mac or Amiga
By: esc to Nightfox on Sun Dec 31 2023 11:58 am

A suggestion if you're into Mac OS9 would be to buy a G4 Mac Mini. There are community efforts which have made it possible to run OS9 natively on the Mac Mini. Running OS9 at 1.5ghz on a G4 is pretty slick :)

That occurred to me this morning. And I was checking eBay for a 1.5ghz Mac Mini G4 but currently don't see any 1.5ghz ones - The fastest I see is the 1.42ghz. I'm considering buying one of those.

Nightfox

Hi Nightfox,

Yeah, it's weird. I'm wondering why Amiga prices are so high, and I
wonder if it's because Amiga was (I think) less popular and could be
more sought-after these days.

C= never intended for the Amiga's to last more than 5 years. They suffer
from bad cap's on the latter models, and the dreded vareta battery
leaking crap all over the board, and in the process destroying it.

This damage is making original boards very hard to find and they are
becoming more rare and scarse. That is why the "re-amiga" boards have
been released, and then it's a matter of moving some of the chips across
to a new board.


\/orlon
aka
Stephen

Rocking Amiga 3000 powerd, Linux M68K.



--- Talisman v0.53-dev (Linux/m68k)
* Origin: Vorlon Empire: Sector 550 (21:1/195.1)

On 30 Dec 23 14:35:06 Nightfox wrote...

Also, from what I've heard, it sounds like one concern with older
computers is the possible need for them to be recapped. I'm okay
with soldering and could probably do that myself, though I might find someone who could do it better and pay them to do it if needed..
Also, I've seen a lot of sellers (on Facebook Marketplace, mainly)
who say they're selling for local pickup only and don't want to ship because they're concerned about damage in shipping. It's a bummer,
because I almost never see a retro computer for sale in my area on
Facebook Marketplace.

Nightfox --- SBBSecho 3.20-Linux * Origin: Digital Distortion: digdist.synchro.net (21:1/137)

To which Commodore Clifford replies...

I'm pretty much an Atari guy, though I do have a handful of other
machines... but for me, it's all pretty much "real hardware or bust".
I've had some machines go on me, though usually, it's due to some issue
(my building has been hit by lightning twice since I lived here, and each
time it cost me the machine running SFHQ BBS, for example).

I'm not really a big fan of the guys who immediately say "recap" whenever someone asks what might be wrong with a machine. I think it's ignorant
to just immediately jump to that conclusion. I've never had to recap any
of my machines yet, and we're talking about quite a lot.

Not that it's never not needed, just that I think it's probably not
necessary as often as it's recommended. But YMMV.

Still, I say the best experience is the real thing, every time.

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

Re: Buying a retro '90s Mac or Amiga
By: vorlon to Nightfox on Mon Jan 01 2024 10:28 am

C= never intended for the Amiga's to last more than 5 years. They suffer from bad cap's on the latter models, and the dreded vareta battery leaking crap all over the board, and in the process destroying it.

That really sucks.. :/ And interesting that Commodore didn't intend for the Amiga to last that long. They were ahead of their time.

This damage is making original boards very hard to find and they are becoming more rare and scarse. That is why the "re-amiga" boards have been released, and then it's a matter of moving some of the chips across to a new board.

Interesting. I've been seeing more hardware solutions for retro systems lately, and it's interesting to see.

Nightfox

Re: Buying a retro '90s Mac or Amiga
By: Commodore Clifford to Nightfox on Sun Dec 31 2023 04:23 pm

I'm not really a big fan of the guys who immediately say "recap" whenever someone asks what might be wrong with a machine. I think it's ignorant to just immediately jump to that conclusion. I've never had to recap any of my machines yet, and we're talking about quite a lot.

I haven't yet bought an old retro computer, but I hear people mention recapping a lot.

Still, I say the best experience is the real thing, every time.

I agree. Though I will say, usually after I start thinking about buying a retro system, I remember that I've also tried a lot of emulation to run old games and programs, and emulation seems to work fairly well much of the time (even though sometimes you have to tweak some settings sometimes).

Nightfox

*** Quoting Nightfox to Esc dated 12-31-23 ***

That occurred to me this morning. And I was checking eBay for a 1.5ghz
Mac Mini G4 but currently don't see any 1.5ghz ones - The fastest I see
is the 1.42ghz. I'm considering buying one of those.

Try searching for "Mac Mini late-2005" on eBay. I'm pretty sure that the 1.5Ghz models were a 'stealth upgrade." I have one, and it's a fantastic little computer.

---
* Origin: Telnet: bbs.WalledCTTY.com:1989 - Fort Collins, CO USA (21:2/145)

Re: Re: Buying a retro '90s Mac or Amiga
By: Abbub to Nightfox on Sun Dec 31 2023 07:58 pm

Try searching for "Mac Mini late-2005" on eBay. I'm pretty sure that the 1.5Ghz models were a 'stealth upgrade." I have one, and it's a fantastic little computer.

I tried that, but there are currently no 1.5ghz G4 Mac Minis.. There are some 1.66ghz 2005 models that come up, but those are the Intel Core 2 Duo versions.

Nightfox

Hi Nightfox,

C= never intended for the Amiga's to last more than 5 years. They suffer from bad cap's on the latter models, and the dreded vareta battery leaking crap all over the board, and in the process
destroying it.

That really sucks.. :/ And interesting that Commodore didn't intend
for the Amiga to last that long. They were ahead of their time.

C= Wanted people to purchase more machines. It wasn't that they didn't
what Amiga's in general to last, it was that they wanted to sell more
units.

This damage is making original boards very hard to find and they
are becoming more rare and scarse. That is why the "re-amiga"
boards have been released, and then it's a matter of moving some of
the chips across to a new board.

Interesting. I've been seeing more hardware solutions for retro
systems lately, and it's interesting to see.

Here's a Amiga 4000 replacement board.

http://amigastore.eu/en/903-amiga-4000-replica-proyect-board-rev-2b.html

Yes there has been a large increase in "new" hardware addon's. for
example RGB to HDMI converters for a better display.

Be aware that the standard Amiga video signal is at 15khz, so a
Scan-Doubler or the above hdmi kit is required for use on modern screens.

There is the http://15khz.wikidot.com/ website, that has a list of
compatable modern screens. I have a Asus VE228H, plus a 23pin to 15pin converter (It's not a straight through adapter).

https://amigastore.eu/en/207-amiga-rgb-to-vga-monitor-adapter.html




\/orlon
aka
Stephen

Rocking Amiga 3000 powerd, Linux M68K.



--- Talisman v0.53-dev (Linux/m68k)
* Origin: Vorlon Empire: Sector 550 (21:1/195.1)

*** Quoting Nightfox to Commodore Clifford dated 12-31-23 ***

I haven't yet bought an old retro computer, but I hear people mention recapping a lot.

They do, as as Commodore Clifford eludes, they often just mention it because they don't know or can't be bothered to figure out what the real problem is. Don't get me wrong, there are definitely bad electrolytics out there, and exploding rifas, but recapping is not the panacea that some people in the retro community would have you believe. Out of my *many* retro computers, I believe the SE30 and the Amiga 2000 power supply are the only things I've actually recapped.

---
* Origin: Telnet: bbs.WalledCTTY.com:1989 - Fort Collins, CO USA (21:2/145)

I had a thought about buying a Mac Mini G4, which I've heard can run Mac OS 9.2.2 (even though not officially supported), and the Mac Mini takes
up a lot less space than a G3 desktop/tower beige Mac that I had been considering. I wonder if a Mac Mini G4 could also run Amiga OS..

It cannot run Amiga OS but it /can/ run MorphOS very well. And MorphOS is a sort of powerpc spiritual successor to Amiga and can run much Amiga software natively.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: m O N T E R E Y b B S . c O M (21:4/173)

That occurred to me this morning. And I was checking eBay for a 1.5ghz Mac Mini G4 but currently don't see any 1.5ghz ones - The fastest I see
is the 1.42ghz. I'm considering buying one of those.

If you can hold out for a 1.5ghz, there are some that include a 'silent upgrade'. What this basically means is Apple doubled the GPU RAM. This doesn't make much of a difference for MacOS 9, but if you decide to use MorphOS, this will be an excellent choice.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: m O N T E R E Y b B S . c O M (21:4/173)

I'm not really a big fan of the guys who immediately say "recap" whenever someone asks what might be wrong with a machine. I think it's ignorant
to just immediately jump to that conclusion. I've never had to recap any of my machines yet, and we're talking about quite a lot.

Yeah, a lot of times you can get away with not recapping for a while. The problem is that leaky caps will do damage to boards that you can't really see until it's too late...and leaky caps are pretty hard to detect. So IMO it's just good preventive maintenance. It's also fun for hardware nerds with soldering guns like me :P Last night I recapped my NES, as well as a Wonderswan Color handheld. Fun times :P

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
* Origin: m O N T E R E Y b B S . c O M (21:4/173)

Buying any retro....

Seems to me, just based on random browsing not a scientific study, that
Amiga prices and other prices have come down a bit, I remember during the pandemic Amiga 2000s would almost fetch a grand, if they worked at all.
Now it seems they are around 600. Again, just my perception, other gear
has dropped too, though not as much (but it didn't spike as much either).

--- RATSoft/FIDO v09.14.95 [JetMail 1.01]
* Origin: STar Fleet HQ - Real Atari! bbs.sfhqbbs.org:5983 (21:3/171.0)

Buying any retro....

Seems to me, just based on random browsing not a scientific study,
that
Amiga prices and other prices have come down a bit, I remember during
the
pandemic Amiga 2000s would almost fetch a grand, if they worked at
all.
Now it seems they are around 600. Again, just my perception, other
gear
has dropped too, though not as much (but it didn't spike as much
either).

I've noticed that too here in Sweden. Prices of certain models (like the A500, of there was plenty sold here) have dropped quite a bit but the flow of computers on the market is still very slow. I guess people are holding on to their treasures, maybe for better times when the economy is better and people can afford to pay premium prices again.

I saw one ad the other day that made me chuckle: some guy was selling one Amiga mouse, the last model (which used to cost like 30-40USD) for 2500 SEK (about 250USD). It hasn't sold yet.


--- NiKom v2.6.0
* Origin: Delta City (deltacity.se, Vallentuna, Sweden) (21:2/130.0)